Dattinderbox's Ban Appeal

[Dattinderbox]

Byond account and character name:-Dattinderbox- -Kurt Jacobs-
Banning admin: It only said host so Jer?
Ban type: Server
Ban reason: No-RP robusting, playing characters that are just so LOL WACKY CRAZY, and near constant use of the word faggot point to a startling lack of maturity that makes me question whether you're even of age to play here.
Ban length: Permanent
Approximate time ban was placed: Unsure it's been about a month or so
Your side of the story: Well. There was a lot of lead up to all of what I did. I was playing a security officer. Doing my usually smoking twenty cigarettes while standing outside security hall and talking to beepsky when it comes around. I act a bit depressed because it's boring, Lexi messages me trying to cheer me up with sex offer or something, I say nah because I only like one man. I go to the bar because I am hungry and there is an assistant girl working the kitchen and botany. They give me a drink that is filled with what I think was soda and space drugs. I take it and enjoy it. Asking for more. I got back to my position then wait a bit. Nothing happens security wise. Keep asking the assistant for more, they say more is coming. More time passes. I made a table and chair to get comfy. I then get more of the drink finally and get high again. Pretty fun. The only fun i had all shift so I stay in the kitchen with the assistant and want to help them make more. Takes a long time and I get impatient, I really want more so I think hey, drugs are addictive, Kurt has an addictive personality, and they are also space drugs which are probably worse than real drugs, there is a reason they are illegal. So I threaten self harm to her in a paniced attempt to get more. I need my hit man. Mind you no one else sees this and she does start PDAing the detective. I believe the assistant then gives me ground up reishi or whatever has sleep toxin. I fall asleep. Tiny detective comes in and without a second thought completely cuffs and strips me and believes everything an assistant messaged over PDA against a fellow sec member. So yell about how you can't just strip a man naked and that she drugged me, etc. Mind you I haven't hurt or attacked anyone at all, not even myself. The tiny detective stripping me completely was way off base and there was no rp involved, even I rp'd my whole paniced drug thing. He obviously wanted to see my naked form the pervert. Something like that would constitute sexual harassment if anything. The assistant thankfully puts my uniform back on. Get taken to sec. Talk about how the assistant was lying and that they should believe a fellow sec member, get put in a cell and my stuff put in a locker, put in bed, no time set, talk more say I want a lawyer or someone for this and the sexual harrassment. The warden and arresting detective tell me I have to stay in the brig until one arrives, aka effectively brigging me for the rest of the round, I pray, one admin I can't remember was on and no pray response. Try to talk about it, they are set on keeping me in the brig for something that would have been a 5-10 minute offense and possible demotion if proved true in court. Believing that there was only one way out from these frustrating people was to make a break for it. So I had everything back but my satchel and ID. I take a taser from my belt and shoot the warden and detective, cuff them, take warden's ID and drag the warden. Start to leave, lag spike and I get DC'd come back to cuffed and harmbatoned by Lexi. I really doubt it was rp'd. Mind you I never hurt or injured anyone throught this entire round and still didn't. Start calling Lexi a faggot because he offered to suck my dick at the beginning of the round, and I was frustrated so I say it a bit. Sorry. Lexi claws and attacks me more for it. Keep calling them faggot. Lexi goes and starts to drain the atmos of my cell, I open the brig door and vent the entire hall, everyone slams into everything. Start to think I need to act a bit unhinged now to maybe plead a mental breakdown and get a lighter sentence and centcomm or in a trial, blame it on the drugs and such. Start talking to this sugar glider sec member that came after I was initially brigged. Talk about religion and unholy abominations, etc. Bless whoever was that player because I'm glad they stayed there to talk to me while I was brigged for quite a while and stuck with me talking throughout all of it. Which is what I usually do. I get brigged a bit and usually will talk to the sec officers while in there. Pretty sure I had my sec/employment/medical record backgrounds all filled. Kurt is a humanity first supporter. I think I died at one point for something. I think I had a damaged lung and low blood so they just killed and cloned me or something. Kurt is heavily against cloning. I wake up from cloning talk a bit, someone blatantly tells me I was cloned, unhappy with life. continue semi-crazy religious rants. Get bored to the charade. Tell the sec member I am done being a nut, that I was just acting. They let me go, IDless guy now, just walking around. Decide I can't take the whole I am just a clone thing, that I have talked about before, a lot. Decide to commit suicide, space assisted. Ghost, see scary ERPs then log out.
Why you think you should be unbanned: Honestly I think they was a bit harsh. I've done it before and it wasn't anything big. Actually it seemed like the only exciting thing that happened in the round. I know I'm not an admin and should try to push situations on others but I like to make my own fun. I can easily say the only person I have EVER her or injured was myself, in all the rounds I've played. I'm not keen on hurt others or taking them out of the round. I don't care about what happens to me to much though. AKA why I will sneak into the away missions so much and explore because well. It's there, it's meant to be explored, and people have actually suited up to go drag my dead corpse back. I usually don't accept cloning though because my character doesn't believe in cloning. So I am sorry when I make others do things they don't want to when I try to make things interesting. I never gameplay wise endanger the crew. Meaning I don't release singularity, spread slimes, depower the station, etc. There are times I have opened the gateway to explore and the admins so stuff like make a xeno invasion. Gateway missions are fun. I am sorry to Lexi for the name calling enough it was sort of in character, harmbatoning me and all before even attempting to detain me in other ways, especially because I had gone braindead for a split second. And I had talked to them in a sorta civil way before all that. As civil as them offering a bj and me denying then talking about how lame futas are through PDA. As for Wacky. I will usually come clean that it is an act when I am brigged. I mean. There are a lot more wowy wacky I'm a silly cutie little fluffy character that act worse or on par with how I did. It is a nice station to interact with some people on but I mainly play to just relax and do things that I want to alone. Like praying to a dark elder god and sacrificing goats on a wire art occult circle. It's fun. I never hurt anyone because of it and never planned to. I mean I've stunned people before and ran but I don't injure them or attack them. That's shitty. And about how old I am, I'm an old man. 23, 24 on Holloween Anyways TL;DR I'm sorry, I don't think it deserved a permanent ban but will tone it down if unbanned. I don't hurt anyone and I just wanna have fun bb. Good serb.
PS. I prayed a lot during that round and not a single response. I was waiting for a admin PM and if I was asked about the incident I would have explained myself but nothing ever came up until I tried getting on the next day. I know there was one admin on but I can't remember.

[Mech__Warrior]

I see several places where things have gone wrong and can divide them into two categories;

Things you did that are questionable; Threatening self harm, tasering the warden and detective, calling Lexi a faggot.

Things other people did that are questionable; Assistant drugging you, detective stripping you after you were cuffed while still in the kitchen, harm batonning somebody who hasn't hurt or killed anybody that round, clawing, draining atmos, and telling Kurt he was a clone.

At some point, I can't help but feel you should have explained things loocly with them since you were trying to fully emulate an addict. Other than that, it seems like things spiraled out of control in the worst way. I'm not an admin, but that's kind of how I see it.

[Arbon]

I think I need to speak up in this one seeing as I was heavily involved with this incident, and a number of points should either be explained (and if incorrect, the behavior rectified) or clarified for this seeming difference in viewpoints. Starting with:

The tiny detective stripping me completely was way off base and there was no rp involved,

The small detective was me, as when the assistant sent a private and rather convincing message asking for assistance, going so far as to speak in riddles as if to make things interesting if someone read her PDA, informing me that one of the security officers was in her workplace threatening her with a knife and demanding she give him space drugs. I stepped over to the room, saw you jittery and constantly moving, giving brief one-line posts, roleplaying out your stuttering, and holding a knife in-hand. I did roleplay first, asking why you were in there and what seems to be the trouble, and you’re in-character response was to say nothing was going on you were just helping her in the kitchen and that I don’t need to pay attention here.

You were indeed exemplary at roleplaying the part of a dangerous armed drug addict, and as you were being accused of brandishing a knife with intent to harm and demanding more drugs the evidence from speaking to you first seemed to indicate that this … well I /thought/ she was the botanist, not an assistant. She had botany access, she was working in the kitchen, she was doing things around botany. I can’t remember if her actual job assignment was botanist or not but she opened the doors for me and clearly had access, and I know I don’t remember questioning this at the time.

There was something of a stand-off in that instance as the girl … Samantha I think? Maybe? I can’t quite remember the name because names always escape me, but she was human and blonde, kept working on what seemed to be the space drugs you wanted. As I stood outside curious you were consistently reclusive and denied having any involvement with drugs at all, taking stances that were believably threatening when asking the botanist to collaborate with your story. In a case of he-said, she-said there was just more evidence pointing to her side while your lies were very easy to see through. Pss, note that attempting to say “Believe me because I’m an officer” is far, far less convincing than “Believe me because of this evidence” as pushing rank usually doesn’t go over well.

I waited outside as I wasn’t able to do anything until the botanist opened the door for me, saw her offer you what she claimed was space drugs, and then you declined. So she went robusty and spamclicked to force the sleeping whatever it was into you, and opened the door for me as soon as you dropped. There /was/ roleplay during the cuffing and stripping, but you were asleep at the time, and the roleplay was between me and this botanist who kept thanking me for coming and listing off all the things she was apparently too afraid to say openly when you had the knife.

He obviously wanted to see my naked form the pervert.

Actually this is a quirk with the security system. Did you know that it is entirely possible to break out of security in less than 10 minutes, using nothing but a rolled up newspaper? If someone wants to break out and will use the mechanics to do so, then anything and everything they have access to is a tool that could accomplish such. Worse, new security is apparently even easier to break through from what I’ve seen and heard. For the vast majority of all arrests I’ve seen on station cuffs aren’t even required, it’s simply a matter of speaking to the person and asking them to come up to security, holding open the door for them, and then about a 5 to 10 minute conversation as they wait out minimum sentencing.

For the rest, if a prisoner is allowed the clothes on their back, that cloth jumpsuit can and will smash through reinforced steel for some reason. Worse is the fact pockets exist and people can slip vests on for extra storage space, and I’ve seen criminals get put into the cell with laser rifles that the officer stripping them somehow missed. If you aren’t going to do things peacefully or calmly, if cuffs have to be used at all, then always fullstrip. Always. Better to take off everything than to leave in something dangerous because you didn’t read and sort all the buttons fast enough, then stuff them into prison clothing if you feel they won’t try to burst down the windows with it.

This oddity has been discussed multiple times before, and the response I’ve always gotten from admins in said discussion was “good” … though admittedly a sexual harassment charge and changing this acting policy, better yet getting into trouble IC for overstepping my bounds, would have been immensely fun to play out.

get put in a cell and my stuff put in a locker, put in bed, no time set, talk more say I want a lawyer or someone for this and the sexual harrassment.

Detectives are not authorized to actually make arrests, and my doing so at the botanists request is something that could have gotten me fired or arrested myself. Which is what I told the warden when I called them in, informed them of the evidence against you, and asked the warden to press charges, set the time on the cell, and handle sentencing, if he so deemed. As well as offering to hand over my ID and stepping into the cell if my own actions warranted such punishment. Didn’t work out because I think I was well vindicated by the time you went on your attacking spree for some reason so no one actually put me in a cell for breaking the law, but that’s getting ahead of myself. A detective is literally incapable of setting time on the cell, because handling prisoners is not their job.

The warden and arresting detective tell me I have to stay in the brig until one arrives, aka effectively brigging me for the rest of the round,

If a lawyer is on and playing then this would work wonderfully as their job is to make sure you are given the best legal protection available. The problem is that you weren’t asking for a lawyer nor asking for a HoP to sign on and get a lawyer here, you were asking for A TRAIL, which is a completely different ball game. As we explained in-character the TRIAL you were asking for requires at least three heads of staff, multiple crewmembers present, several in-game hours of processing and discussion among multiple parties, two lawyers to present the cases on each side (unless we just skip that and have defendant and prosecution represent themselves) and would have taken more time than we had left on the shift.

The sexual harassment charges against me were pretty easy to handle and just resulted in me offering to turn in my ID and let the warden handle final decision on that, but a trial … its really, really difficult to get a trial going, and this always depresses me.

Try to talk about it, they are set on keeping me in the brig for something that would have been a 5-10 minute offense and possible demotion if proved true in court.

From what I recall your attempt at talking things out was constant racial slurs and endless streams of insults toward me, toward the botonist, toward the warden, toward all non-humans, and claiming that the only reason you were there is because I was personally racist against humans. Did make me burst out laughing seeing as Arbon outright adores humanity for a number of reasons mostly relating to his expanded intelligence, as described in-character, but please be aware that talking things out works better if you type more than five words at a time, wait to allow people to respond, and if you say something more meaningful than random slurs. All you needed to do was convince the warden that you were innocent and I was out of line, acting like someone dangerous that should be put in a cell isn’t the best way to go about this.

Believing that there was only one way out from these frustrating people was to make a break for it. So I had everything back but my satchel and ID. I take a taser from my belt and shoot the warden and detective, cuff them, take warden's ID and drag the warden.

Case and point about the full-stripping, as it became quite clear that trusting you with a weapon and cuffs and ID as we had during these negotiations and argument was a mistake. I never realized you’d disconnected, but what you missed there was me calling out for someone else to handle taking you down (I had no weapons at all, just had the cuffs) while breaking free, announcing the situation and the random attack against myself and the warden over the radio. Announced the warden was incapacitated and for assistance to come to security. Lexi was CE and happened to have the situation under control by the time I got there, and I seem to remember there being a split between some people … well, a handful … okay me and maybe two others, telling Lexi to stop clawing you and get medical attention up here. Meanwhile the rest seemed to just want you to stay down.

Lexi goes and starts to drain the atmos of my cell, I open the brig door and vent the entire hall, everyone slams into everything.

Aaahh, so is that what happened? I was always confused about why the room started venting and what could have caused that. I was told you did it somehow via messing with the floor scrubber (don’t really know how that works, am not an engineer) and when you first started suffocating I remember personally opening the door to pull you out, wanting you in a safer cell. I think by that time you were in a straitjacket rather than cuffs, don’t quite remember who put you in it.

Talk about religion and unholy abominations, etc.

I do remember that’s what you were calling the entire crew, yes. And that security player is indeed an excellent one to have, wish I could remember her name but she’s still around at time of writing. And then from the rest I really can’t comment as I wasn’t there to see it happen, or at least wasn’t in enough of the thick of it to see what happened. I highly doubt people would have killed you deliberately and then cloned you afterword just to avoid surgery, you were bleeding out and gasping constantly and all it would have taken is bad RNG on that popped lung to suffocate randomly. It’s not impossible mind, but I outright prefer being killed and cloned as it works faster and almost every medical I see outright refuses on principle. An annoying trend in my eyes, but good for people who don’t like being cloned.

I can easily say the only person I have EVER her or injured was myself, in all the rounds I've played.

There is a major problem with this aspect in that suicide syndrome players /are/ a bannable offence, if you are constantly hurting yourself and are the type of person to just suicide when bored then it can get rather depressing for other players to have to deal with. Especially anyone who has gone through suicidal tendencies before, or had a friend go through suicidal tendencies. In much the same way that certain insults, especially Faggot and Nigger (note: I have not seen you say it but it’s the same level of insult), can be exceedingly hurtful trigger words enticing certain actions against you.

Lastly, also be aware that if you start non-roleplay combat such (as what happened with the taser when you felt breaking free yourself would be easier than sitting through 5-10 minutes and explaining things to the warden) then other players are /not/ forced to maintain roleplay, otherwise its simply not possible to catch you.

__________________________________________

In my summary as one of the people responsible for and largely involved in the beginnings of these events, I will suggest approving this ban appeal. Mostly on the grounds that while fast paced and robust heavy, it was indeed solid roleplay and he managed exactly the feel of character he wanted. The biggest bit of harm caused was the constant insults to everyone, which has been apologized for in a manner that makes it clearly established that calling people names won’t make for a solid community. And while I would naturally prefer a different flavor of event in most cases, stirring up occasional trouble and making things happen is something we need more of.

There’s always a balance to be had there as going too far (especially without being an actual event) can lead to an entire crowd of players who had their erotic roleplay disrupted to shout “Greifer! Ban he!” on skype and in private messeges, but get the balance down and know when to /not/ stir the station into an uproar and it’s a much welcome addition to the station.

Not an admin, but If my words mean anything I’d caution toward approval.

[Dattinderbox]

He obviously wanted to see my naked form the pervert.

This was more of a joke =o)

Worse is the fact pockets exist and people can slip vests on for extra storage space, and I’ve seen criminals get put into the cell with laser rifles that the officer stripping them somehow missed.

That makes more sense now. Still though I usually try to think about real situations when playing serious security, because I actually am armed shitcurity. Like I will never strip bare a person that is cuffed and being pulled until it's in private. Also trying to get a female officer to strip a female crewmember. I mean as long as someone is cuffed and being dragged, unless they have some sort of escape bonds quickly item, they shouldn't be able to ever access their inventory. My pebis was in plain sight and there was a woman around, I was so embarrassed!

and when you first started suffocating I remember personally opening the door to pull you out, wanting you in a safer cell.

Ah, okay that's what happened. Mainly I just remember everyone slamming into walls, gave me a chuckle.

There is a major problem with this aspect in that suicide syndrome players /are/ a bannable offence, if you are constantly hurting yourself and are the type of person to just suicide when bored then it can get rather depressing for other players to have to deal with. Especially anyone who has gone through suicidal tendencies before, or had a friend go through suicidal tendencies. In much the same way that certain insults, especially Faggot and Nigger (note: I have not seen you say it but it’s the same level of insult), can be exceedingly hurtful trigger words enticing certain actions against you.

I don't usually actively hurt myself, I just put myself in harmful situations most of the time, aka away missions or monster fighting. Only times I've really ever injured myself was when I was doing up a cultist gimmick and trying to appease my elder gods and cut my hand with a knife. About suicide though, I never just flat out "lol I'm killing myself" I usually do have some sort of mental reasoning behind it. As for what I say to others, I've always believed in "sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me" yes it sounds childish but so is overreacting if someone calls you a name you don't like. I mean I didn't realize this was a trigger friendly SJW like server to be honest. I can easily tone it down, and that was the first time I ever even said faggot on the server. I just tend to think words are just words, and if you can be so easily shaken by them you need to rethink some things.

I will suggest approving this ban appeal. Mostly on the grounds that while fast paced and robust heavy, it was indeed solid roleplay and he managed exactly the feel of character he wanted.

Yay!

And while I would naturally prefer a different flavor of event in most cases, stirring up occasional trouble and making things happen is something we need more of.

Yep, if everyone if just sitting at the bar /me'ing their characters that's fine but I mean the best ways to establish character aspects/flaws/personalities is in stressful or pressing situations. Whenever I would go to the away mission I would constantly try to get someone else to come with me because I really enjoy a element of danger to my rp because it's a lot more interesting to me to see how characters react.

Again I'd like to say that I didn't actually physically harm anyone throughout that entire shift. I think hurting other players is rude. Stunning is different though, to me at least.

[Aces]

Sorry for not getting to this sooner.

So, the actual ban reason reads the following:

No-RP robusting, playing characters that are just so LOL WACKY CRAZY, and near constant use of the word faggot point to a startling lack of maturity that makes me question whether you're even of age to play here. Underage ban.

So, you have to prove you're over 18 before anything else. Contact me privately to do this. View the sticky thread to understand how this is done.

You have until next Friday before this app gets autorejected if you do not contact me with the correct information.

[Aces]

Age verified.

Appeal approved.