[JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

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[JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

Postby HzDonut » Mon Jun 18, 2018 5:20 pm

https://imgur.com/a/xkDWaTh (I can't get the image to embed properly, but it's a screenshot of the ban)

Byond account and character name: HzDonut. Jesse Soemmer and 24 other characters

Banning admin: JerTheAce

Ban type (What are you banned from?): Quality Control Ban, server and discord.

Ban reason: It's a long one, see the picture up top.

Ban length: Permanent.

Approximate time ban was placed (including time zone): 2018-06-01, 20:07:19 (EST).

Your side of the story: I got a talking to a while back over being way too negative all the time and got ordered to improve or get the boot, so I improved...and got the boot anyway. Basically, I just started providing constructive criticism during discussions like Ace told me to while improving my attitude as much as possible in the short frame of time I had before I got banned, simple as that. Hell I even warned everyone that while I was trying my best to improve, it'd be some time before I was completely "fixed" as I needed to get rid of a LOT of learned negative behaviors.

Why you think you should be unbanned: As I said right there, I had improved just like I was told to, yet I got banned anyways. Not only that but the ban claims I'm 'toxic' when not a single person believes that (asked both friends and people who I'm not close to at all, but have seen me talking in the chat plenty of times. Nobody agreed with the ban at all and the general consensus was that I could get a bit snippy at times, but no worse than anybody else does and "There are definitely people who are worse than you who aren't banned.") If for some reason you all don't believe me, I guess just open it up to community input since apparently it was the community that I was so 'toxic' to, so surely their opinion matters more than the admins who were hardly around when I was active, no? Plus for the most part my "negative behavior" was just in the discord, and on the server I behaved just like everybody else unless some catastrophic event caused my mood to sour but in those cases I'd be salting with everybody else who also had their time ruined, thus I feel like being banned from both was unnecessary. That's why I'm mainly making this appeal, as I'm pretty upset over losing 25 characters, countless hours, and numerous relationships (from friend to foe) over some admins thinking I'm a toxic shitter when that's clearly not true in the slightest. If I was just booted from the discord I'd care much, much less. Anyways, to wrap things up (I'll keep rambling and rambling if I don't do this), even though the admin team clearly didn't notice or care, I really was trying my best to improve as I have way, way too much investment in this place to just dump it because I'd rather continue to be a negative nancy then listen to some admins who I have personal issues with, that'd be absolutely ridiculous behavior. Just unban me and be a bit more patient and you'll see improvement, I promise you that.
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Re: [JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

Postby HzDonut » Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:29 pm

Oh right, I forgot. Even if I don't improve/have a moment where I slip back into old habits, I have a l'il group I'm in that's full of likeminded people with whom I can comfortably vent so y'all would see none of it anyways. There's not really a reason to not unban me.
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Re: [JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

Postby nerdass » Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:21 am

if the entirety of your "why you feel you should be unbanned" portion can be summed up with "Fuck the administration, I'm right, unban me." then it's not exactly going to go very well for you.

As a matter of fact, I'd go as far as to say that it reinforces why you were banned in the first place.

"There's worse people than me who aren't banned" also doesn't work, because you can't use other people being shitty as justification for why you were shitty either.

No support.
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Re: [JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

Postby arokha » Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:34 am

HzDonut wrote:Hell I even warned everyone that while I was trying my best to improve, it'd be some time before I was completely "fixed" as I needed to get rid of a LOT of learned negative behaviors.

That doesn't mean you need to be HERE while improving. As an example of how some other SS13 servers work... when you're banned, and appeal, they ask you to prove that you've been playing on another SS13 server and haven't had any issues there. The thought being 'well you don't belong here, but maybe if you play on a similar server, and the admins there can vouch for you, then maybe you can appeal here'. Note that it's generally a requirement of filing an appeal on those servers, not just 'the thing that means you get unbanned'.

HzDonut wrote:As I said right there, I had improved just like I was told to, yet I got banned anyways. Not only that but the ban claims I'm 'toxic' when not a single person believes that

So you asked a bunch of people you know if you were a bad person. I'm unsure why you think this is 'everyone', given that 'not a single person believes that', except for the 75%+ of admins who voted to QCban you.

HzDonut wrote:I guess just open it up to community input since apparently it was the community that I was so 'toxic' to, so surely their opinion matters more than the admins who were hardly around when I was active, no?

Are you saying that admins are not part of the community? That's an unusual sentiment, and sort of exemplifies the general 'us-vs-them' attitude you had in the Discord whenever there was something admins disagreed with you about, such as your repeated 'fuck the rules' whenever someone pointed out you were breaking them.

HzDonut wrote:Plus for the most part my "negative behavior" was just in the discord, and on the server I behaved just like everybody else unless some catastrophic event caused my mood to sour but in those cases I'd be salting with everybody else who also had their time ruined, thus I feel like being banned from both was unnecessary.

This almost feels like a "Well if you won't unban me from Discord then unban me from the server", but that's not how it usually works. The rules we felt you were in violation of were part of the global community rules, not server rules. Perhaps moreso, the ban was the ultra-rare QC ban, which some people might disagree with this, but doesn't need you to have broken rules to be removed.


HzDonut wrote:over some admins thinking I'm a toxic shitter when that's clearly not true

75%+ vote...

HzDonut wrote:I'd rather continue to be a negative nancy then listen to some admins who I have personal issues with, that'd be absolutely ridiculous behavior. Just unban me and be a bit more patient and you'll see improvement, I promise you that.

This attitude is shitty and egotistical. "I'd rather to continue to be an asshole and ignore admins, unban me". You don't get that choice.

No support from me.
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Re: [JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

Postby Molenar » Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:37 am

I'd pick a point or two from this appeal to poke at for reasons why it just reinforces the reasoning for the ban, but really, reading through it, i don't think this was even meant to be an appeal so much as a big middle finger to the staff here, but hey,
HzDonut wrote: I have a l'il group I'm in that's full of like minded people with whom I can comfortably vent
good for you, you can go back there now and vent about how your snarky as fuck appeal only brought you more snark in return.
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Re: [JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

Postby Demicus_Maximus » Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:53 am

I was originally voting in your favor when this all happened. While I'd had some issues with you personally, they weren't deal breakers and I believed you had been improving a lot.

Now, there was the time you came down while myself and another scientist were RPing out some minor synth repairs, three of us doing just fine, as a ghost to berate us in LOOC about how to do our jobs. And I had to give you the verbal boot since "we know what we're doing as players, our characters aren't all knowing" was proving difficult for you to grasp. Then sat around in deadchat whining till you realized it was an admin you were shittalking.

Now I say to myself, 'meh, that only really affected me, and I've got thicker skin than that. I'll vote to keep him around anyway, it'll be fine.'

Then I see you log in during a disaster on the station for the sole purpose of sitting in deadchat, shittalking people. Then more of the same the next day. Not even the usual deadchat "Oh man that sucks" level of chat, just mean-spirited "fuck those guys" kind of chat. Really ground my gears, so deadchat got turned off for a while as a result.

In the end, there is no smoking gun. No single action that we felt was worthy of this. Just a thousand and one little grievances that kept piling up. Hell, even some of us who voted to ban were saying "Man, we love to RP with Donut, they're great fun when they're behaving... but..." And it's that "But" that got you the boot. :<
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Re: [JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

Postby HzDonut » Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:19 am

Look if I came across as snarky it wasn't intentional, I assure you I'm being as sincere as possible here when I'm talking to you about my improving; that was just a way of saying "you won't have any more problems out of me in the future". Yes, I'm fully aware that I was a real asshole in the past, I'm certainly not denying that, I'm just pointing out that up until my boot I do feel like I was showing some signs of improving is all. Plus I never said "fuck the administration, I'm right", where on Earth did I say that? I just mentioned that yes I do have problems with some admin staff but that's not going to prevent me from listening to them in the future at all. I really, really want to be allowed back into the server to continue having the fun I was having before I was booted, like I said. I have way too many memories to mess it all up now. Apologies for seeming to have worded it poorly earlier, hopefully this clears some of that up.

And no no no I didn't mean that admin opinion didn't matter, that'd be rediculous, I was just thinking that perhaps community input would be more useful since they were the people I was supposedly antagonizing to warrant my ban is all! The admin team isn't always around and paying attention, after all, maybe community members noticed things you didn't?
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Re: [JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

Postby HzDonut » Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:26 am

Demicus_Maximus wrote:I was originally voting in your favor when this all happened. While I'd had some issues with you personally, they weren't deal breakers and I believed you had been improving a lot.

Now, there was the time you came down while myself and another scientist were RPing out some minor synth repairs, three of us doing just fine, as a ghost to berate us in LOOC about how to do our jobs. And I had to give you the verbal boot since "we know what we're doing as players, our characters aren't all knowing" was proving difficult for you to grasp. Then sat around in deadchat whining till you realized it was an admin you were shittalking.

Now I say to myself, 'meh, that only really affected me, and I've got thicker skin than that. I'll vote to keep him around anyway, it'll be fine.'

Then I see you log in during a disaster on the station for the sole purpose of sitting in deadchat, shittalking people. Then more of the same the next day. Not even the usual deadchat "Oh man that sucks" level of chat, just mean-spirited "fuck those guys" kind of chat. Really ground my gears, so deadchat got turned off for a while as a result.

In the end, there is no smoking gun. No single action that we felt was worthy of this. Just a thousand and one little grievances that kept piling up. Hell, even some of us who voted to ban were saying "Man, we love to RP with Donut, they're great fun when they're behaving... but..." And it's that "But" that got you the boot. :<


Oof, yeah, I got informed about my behavior in deadchat being way out of line after my ban unfortunately. After that I looked back on some logs I had and MAN I cannot deny that was definitely a problem for some time. I really don't know what got into me there but I assure you that I'm fully aware of the issue now and it will never happen again, I feel terrible looking back and seeing how I treated people. Terrible as in "I feel like I'm going to be sick from this pit in my stomach" levels of terrible. I never really meant to be as big of an ass as I was, I swear, I just...had a lot of really negative shit going on at the time that got under my skin and caused me to act out in ways I was blind to until it was way too late. The most notable one being financial stresses from student loans but, thankfully, I have those in check now and am feeling a hell of a lot more relaxed than I was before.
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Re: [JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

Postby HzDonut » Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:28 am

All I'm asking for here is just a chance, a chance to prove to you guys that I'm honestly not as bad as I was back then. If I manage to fuck it up then yeah, I'll take whatever's coming my way from that, but I just feel like I was robbed of my chance to prove myself earlier by this ban that blindsinded me! I'm in a lot more of a stable place now that I've surrounded myself with positive people and fixed some things in my life that was causing me a lot of stress, and I really do offer my deepest apologies for any stress and frustration I caused during that period of extreme negativity I was in.
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Re: [JerTheAce] HzDonut - QC Ban

Postby HzDonut » Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:30 am

nerdass wrote:if the entirety of your "why you feel you should be unbanned" portion can be summed up with "Fuck the administration, I'm right, unban me." then it's not exactly going to go very well for you.

As a matter of fact, I'd go as far as to say that it reinforces why you were banned in the first place.

"There's worse people than me who aren't banned" also doesn't work, because you can't use other people being shitty as justification for why you were shitty either.

No support.


Hey now I wasn't using "There's worse people than me who aren't banned" as justification for me being shitty, that's honestly just what people said. I was shitty for my own personal reasons and I'm sure those people act the way they do because of their own personal reasons, there's no connections between us at all like "I'm bad because they're bad".
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