[JertheAce] DeepIndigo -Permanent Everything ban

[DeepIndigo]

I'm going to address some points here in no particular order other than the order they occur in within the posts I quote.
For clarity and not making the page too long, I've spoilered my responses to keep them direct and as easy to suss out as I can.
To Aronai

[+]

When you posted your appeal, some of the other admins started pasting parts of the logs from the previous appeal, and it reminded me that you were coming up with your own ideas on what you should do to me, beyond whatever things 'O' suggested doing.

I'm betting a fair bit was missing from those, just like it was last time. Yes there was brainstorming happening. No I'm not proud of having taken any part in any of this at all.

It's clear that while they suggested the plan that you eventually went with, they didn't coerce you into it, and in fact you seemed to take it on as the leader of the 'cabal' when you thought it might have me resign.

I did organize it and take the helm to make it move forward, yes. I got all the parties involved in contact, too.

'O' barely says anything after the start,

Much of the initial formulation happened in private conversation between 'O' and my self.

and you take over constantly reassuring 'A' that they are doing the right thing.

Yeah, it was absolutely disgusting of me to do. Every time I look back I kinda feel like I turned into Mr. Hyde or some #%^% and I want to vomit. Before then I never thought my self capable of that sort of thing, and after, I'm pretty scared to know that I have done it. I'm also rather concerned about whether or not I'll catch my self leading up to it again, but determined to do so and prevent it.

'O' never mentioned doxxing me, yet you suggested that it'd be a good idea, saying you had contacts, for example. In fact they spoke against it and you tried to convince THEM it was a good idea.

They were the first to mention having your details, actually, if memory serves. Before that, it was not even part of the discussion.

It doesn't speak of someone conflicted about what they are doing, or somehow deceived into the act. I digress, however, from the appeal.

I make no claim to have been conflicted at the time. I was pretty salty and zealous, and as such sort of took over as the spine of the group. I took the situation and ran with it, entirely too far, which is to say at all.

The issue is that it seems you still contend in some parts you aren't responsible for your actions.

I take full responsibility for my actions. I simply don't wish to be painted as an identity thief and the absolute only one at fault, because I am neither. I'm absolutely at fault, but I will not be misrepresented. I offered my knowledge of how identity theft is done. When you have as much free time as me you learn some skeevy ^%&#. I should not have even dignified the mention of your personal info with anything more than "no", and had I not been as upset as I was, "no" is all I would have said.

In fact part of the appeal reads that you should be unbanned 'because you've suffered enough' which is not really the point of a ban, to make someone suffer, rather the point is to separate you from the community until such a time when including you would be appropriate.

Not what I intended to convey at all. The point I was attempting to make abundantly clear is that I've thought about this a lot, and that I do deeply regret and feel shame for my actions. That I'm not without remorse or regret over my past behavior.

I'm told by people who claim they are close to you that you wanted me removed because of my manipulation,

That is exactly why. Everything I'd heard from others pointed to that, as well as (at least from my perspective) things I'd seen. I let my self get lost in the craziness instead of simply treying to see as much as possible to form my own opinion properly.

and that I somehow was opposed to someone being an admin, and didn't want Zalvine as an admin.

I'm really not sure where this aspect came from, to be perfectly honest. I had reasons to suspect why you might not want certain people as admins, but nothing against Zal in particular. At least, so far as I recall presently.

I notice you don't mention it, but this also came shortly after I 'didn't support' your admin app because I thought you acted strangely about certain things on the server, namely any admin ruling involving you, and I wasn't sold on the idea of you being an admin. I didn't 'kill your admin app', I was just the last to comment on it. Other people had already not given support.

I didn't mention this because I don't want to give the impression I'm bitter over being denied. I'm not, I get denied for stuff like that all the time. The resent there came from how your reasoning in the thread was at best 50% false (you'd said I had been publicly !#$%-talking people), and when I asked you directly about it, your response was "I'dunno I think maybe I heard that once, from someone ¯\_(ツ)_/¯". The idea you'd knowingly do the thing you accuse me of now (base stuff on shaky or no intel) combined with other perceived concerns at the time was super suspicious.

Given that the above things don't appear to be true (Not supporting Zalvine, manipulating Nightwing out of being an admin), I would assume it'd be hard to find good evidence to support them, which makes me think you acted based on unjustified beliefs with no knowledge, to the point you were suggesting doxxing someone to get rid of them, potentially ruining part of their life to get them to stop playing a video game. If this is what you are willing to do based on 'what you heard' then I'm not sure you have the proper mindset to participate in this community. I feel like you'd second-guess every admin decision and wonder if there's some conspiracy going on behind the scenes: the exact reason I didn't support your admin app originally, since you didn't seem to agree with any admins about any decisions.

It was the testimony of a good many people, admin and not, including parties directly involved, that was factored in to my choices. I suppose it doesn't matter how many times I remind you I didn't directly suggest identity theft, you're going to stick to the notion that I did, so whatever. Thinking back, I'm sure some of the information suffered from being telephoned (moving through multiple people and being distorted as a result) in a good number of instances, but this was a case for concern that was building over months, in my eyes.

I feel like you'd second-guess every admin decision and wonder if there's some conspiracy going on behind the scenes

Not really, but I can see why you'd feel that way.

You appealed within a very short time after I had just explained what happened to the other admins.

This wasn't so much eagerness or trying to jump the gun as I'd tried to get a hold of Ace multiple times, since I'd woken up that day to find VS gone from my discord and like half my friendslist gone, and a good third blocking me the moment I spoke to them. The only response from Ace I'd gotten was "Appeal if you dare" so I figured "I guess this will be the only way to reach Ace and the other admins to discuss this", which in the moment to me panicked mind (with everything I'd come to value over the year prior flying apart at the seems) seemed like the most pressing thing before the situation got too big and too public.

Given the above, I'm not supporting your appeal at this time. This doesn't mean that it's denied, just that I personally don't think you satisfy those two aspects of what I would want to see in an appealing banned person.

Understandable, and more fair that I deserve really.

I should mention that I forgave you a long time ago. Whether that means I think you would be a good fit here, or ever want to speak to you again, is unrelated.

Well, thank you. It brings me a good deal of peace to know you've forgiven me. As for the other two things, I hope some day you'll consider those.

To Silenced

[+]

нет.

Short and to the point, comrade. I can respect that, but I'm also a bit disheartened that even after all this time you've nothing more to say.

To the Wah

[+]

I'tha, DI.

<3

The aftershocks are still making their circles, I've yet to go a month where you aren't brought up in shall we say a very unpleasant way. The chances of you being chased right back out, or people taking anything you do with an extremely critical eye are exceptionally high. You nuked any good name you had, and you've yet to be forgotten. I have to take in consideration the effects of what would happen if you were returned to the fold, as of right now and it would not be beneficial. Not for you, not for the community. Simply, you're incredibly infamous and that's going to take a lot of time to die off. It's too soon for you to return, unfortunately.

'I suppose that's to be expected. I'm not super surprised by any of that really.

Which brings me to point two. I have doubts. Reasonably so, through this mess it's no secret you managed to backstab me.

This is among the greatest of my regrets in all this.

It's not something I'm sure I've actually recovered from completely, you were a rather good friend of mine. I could go further with this, but to get back on target. I want to believe you, but you also gave me reason to doubt you. I do believe you've been miserable, and you've been hit hard by this. The major question I have is Why? I can't fully answer that. To reiterate, there's absolutely no argument that you've been miserable. What's the reason for it though? That you truly regret your actions.

As I said, I've been kicking my self over my actions every single day. That's not an exaggeration, it's the literally first thing I think about before I go to sleep, and if I'm not shaken out of it, it keeps me up. I was a really #$%@$# thing to do. Each and every time I think about it, I've been stewing over how reprehensible and stupid the things I did and said are. I was not okay then, it was not okay now. Looking back, I can hardly believe I did any of it. At first I was a bit upset at how many people wordlessly cut me off without at least asking for my side, but I can't say I truly blame them.

What I've left to say is this. You have potential, and you've quite the talents...if only you'd look past certain things, maybe instead of assuming from the get go, try to see it from another angle. I don't want you walking away from this, stagnating and carrying a chip on your shoulder. You made a hell of a mistake, that really only time and your own growth can repair. You say you realize what you did, how it was wrong, how it played out. Where do you plan to go from here?

I don't want you walking away from this, stagnating and carrying a chip on your shoulder. You made a hell of a mistake, that really only time and your own growth can repair. You say you realize what you did, how it was wrong, how it played out. Where do you plan to go from here?

How do you anticipate to handle these situations in the future? What are you going to become?

By using the proper channels for complaints and the like, should I see reason to lodge complaints. By being a hell of a lot more in control of my self in the future. By finding a better, healthier way to handle and exercise my frustrations.Hopefully, some day, I'll be able to come back here and do things right some day.

A conspiracy to remove others, and instill yourself as part of the command/leadership.

That second part was not a goal at the time, just feel I should make clear.

Finally. I'll say this. I forgive you, Indi. Shit happens. What you do after a mistake is what matters. I've unblocked you a while ago, balls in your court there.

More than I deserve. I will not squander this, you have my word.

To Firefly

[+]

HAH, No. Everything I'd wanna say has already been said above. You not only fucked yourself with the shit you tried to pull, but you nearly fucked quite a few other regular players here. Take your pity party somewhere else.

I'm not sure who you are, nor am I sure you completely understand the entire situation. Whatever the case, I regret this being the circumstance in which you come to know me. This is not a good example of who I am or how I work. It's an immensely shameful failing on my part. I hope that if we speak in the future, it's with less hostility.

To Seiga

[+]

I don't know you or much of the admin team on a personal level.

If you want to for nothing else than to form a more informed opinion (I mean that in the most objective sense. I'm in no way impugning you or your evaluative ability), I've no objection to you getting to know me.

To let you back in on the basis that you 'were misled' would demonstrate that you can just apply to get back in after you pull this sort of stunt.

It would set a bad precedent in the minds of many, yes. But I like to think it would also serve as a great example of a bad case seeking redemption.

As a general comment, since this is now open to community discussion, people shouldn't be pulling this sort of stunt to begin with. If you no longer have faith in the administration, you shouldn't be here.

Wasn't so much doubt in the whole thing as concern for what at the time looked to be issues within it surrounding a few parties, with Aronai at the center of that.

To Ace

[+]

I'm sorry you still feel the way you do, and I hope that in time, you too, will come to forgive me, unban or not.

To Demmers

[+]

Sorry. I think you're a great person to RP with,

I'm glad you think so, I try to make my characters as complex and people-y as possible.

and you may very well have improved over these past months...

I'd like to think I have.

but I don't feel that you should return at this time. Try me again in another six months, or a year, make some personal appeals to the individuals you've wronged... then maybe I'll be more inclined to support an appeal. But I just cannot vote yes right now.

I've been making those appeals to the few who will actually give me the time of day to speak to them and haven't completely cut off my every method of contacting them. I've called in a lot of favors from mutual friends of those people to relay things at the risk of burning those bridges too, and I've been fortunate enough to be indulged, to very mixed results. 'A' was among the first, in fact.
Some are understandably still... less than open, to communicating.

At any rate, thank you all for your time and

[DeepIndigo]

At any rate, thank you all for your time and

forgiveness (where applicable), as well as your consideration of what I've said and not flat-out forum banning me too.

[Kayleen]

As a member of the community, I stand by the last words I said to you before I blocked you.

I don't recall what they were exactly, but I'm pretty sure I just said "fuck you".

[ulviiriara]

Maybe its just me but, in response to people saying that the shockwaves of this are still going around, I'm going to be honest. I had forgotten this had happened. And I have not seen it talked about SINCE his last ban appeal. WITH that in mind, there is something to be said about being willing to go to some rather extreme, life destroying means just to get at someone for.... Denying adminhood and being a dick in your view. That just seems a little to far to the extreme, and one that it would be incredibly hard to judge if you have come back from, or are just hiding the hate and anger so you can play her again, or worse, to get back into the community, and be like a viper ready to strike, gathering friends to your own side until you feel like its time to strike out against those who wronged you, in your mind.

In my view, you will SERIOUSLY have to prove that neither of those are the case before I would ever feel comfortable around you again.

[Aces]

And just like the first app, judging by what he said in his replies to some of us, he's doing exactly the same thing he did in the first appeal. "Oh I'm sorry but not really sorry because it wasn't my fault actually / someone else started it."

I'm not going to waste my time with this one.

Appeal Rejected