[Dragor] Muffindrake - Server and Discord ban

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Re: [Dragor] Muffindrake - Server and Discord ban

Postby Enzo Leon » Mon Dec 19, 2022 4:51 pm

No.
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Re: [Dragor] Muffindrake - Server and Discord ban

Postby Muffindrake » Mon Dec 19, 2022 10:56 pm

Scree wrote:
Muffindrake wrote:That being said if the conduct seen in that ahelp was a regular thing you would definitely see punishments applied. My remarks are empty aside from mechanics-related shenanigans, however.

See, the thing is, the peanut thread suggests it is a regular thing.

If this was 6 months ago I'd've banned him for being a sputum floating their way through the toilet bowl of life, and dared the other 2 headmins to overturn it.

Some of their recent tickets include demaning an admin tell them if someone was messing with telecomms so they can decide whether to suicide or not, demanding an admin revive them because their cryopod didn't seem to be working, and ahelping to complain that all of their traitor rounds have been ruined recently, as well as to complain a maintainer was trolling them and closing their tickets.

Oh, did I say some of their recent tickets? What I actually meant to say was this is a cross-section of their tickets from a single shift 11 hours ago.

This guy's ahelp quotient is enough to train half a dozen admins how to respond "IC issue" and "Rule 10" per hour.

This lizard is constantly making admin complaints and ban appeals over petty reasons. This lizard needs to chill the fuck out. Quite recently they smashed a bunch of windows around engineering as an atmos tech while I was watching, and they refused to stop. They used the excuse of them wanting insuls even though the windows they smashed had absolutely nothing to do with obtaining them. They never explained the actual reason, even when I captured them, and even when I started demoting them.

They also got extremely mad quite a few times. They thought I messed with the air alarm on a delamming SM, screeching at me then salting in dchat.

I think this lizard needs to go to therapy or something to sort out their anger issues, because sometimes they become a salt mine.


An awful lot of your time on the forums there seems to be admin complaints because the admins refused to intervene on your behalf to tell other players how you think they should be playing the game.
Particularly asimov AIs when you're playing a lizard. Even from a mechanical PoV you see how that's an issue, right?
And threatening admins with admin complaints when they smash the IC issue button. You see how that becomes an OOC issue, right?

Specifically, the kind of OOC issue that got you kicked out of here in the first place.


The game is ridiculously opaque mechanics-wise and the atmospherics wiki for TG is horribly outdated, getting _good_ information on many Engineering aspects of the game is extremely difficult. Those weren't demands to have situations ingame bent to my will, I was merely trying to get an admin to relay particular mechanics to other players so that they can make better decisions in the future. There does not exist a direct channel to talk to a person on TG, and if you can't figure out who they are on discord, even if their DMs aren't by default restricted to friends, there is no other way to get a hold of them aside from an admin literally direct messaging them ingame. There was no other motive to ask the admin to talk to players other than this, and I've explained this several times, but that is conveniently not mentioned in the peanut gallery. Using the global ingame OOC is not an option, since that may share information to other players about the current round which is a rule break.

Some of their recent tickets include demaning an admin tell them if someone was messing with telecomms so they can decide whether to suicide or not, demanding an admin revive them because their cryopod didn't seem to be working, and ahelping to complain that all of their traitor rounds have been ruined recently, as well as to complain a maintainer was trolling them and closing their tickets.


Those were requests, not demands. They weren't phrased as demands. Ahelping to request something is explicitly allowed and a perfectly normal thing to do on the server, but you obviously have no expectation that an admin will do that. 99% of my ahelps and prays are either silly requests or requests for silly stuff, the vanishing rest is asking whether they'd be willing to give up a sliver of information so that I can Ghost and move on to do something else. Regardless of that, that was the situation that I outlined in the post above. A maintainer was in fact closing tickets in one shift even though they aren't actually admins and dealing with tickets isn't something they're supposed to do. I've talked about this with another admin via ahelp, but Iain0 does not really bother wasting time on peanut threads like that. I don't know if they talked to the maintainer about that, and I have never seen that maintainer write on the forums either. That admin has multiple times painted my interactions in those threads in the worst possible light at all times, while leaving out crucial information.

In another thread, which was concerning AIs as well as random players ruining half an hour of work with the press of a button, the admin I levelled a complaint against asserted that 'do something about it' is the same thing as asking another player to get banned, which is just great. There are enough ahelps where I ask admins to relay specifically mechanics-related information _because_ _there_ _simply_ _is_ _no_ _other_ _good_ _way_ to let that specific player know the parameters of what they're doing.

They are always free to make the choice that fucks me, but I really just wanted to ensure that player had all the information available to them and still took that one specific choice in the face of all other information I had painstakingly tried to let them know. In those cases, the information is too specific to put on a wiki page, so that wouldn't be a solution to the problem either.

Completely deranged. You got minorly inconvenienced by an antagonist and as a result not only ahelped them but then complainted the admin for not banning them.


Besides all that, you should take peanut gallery threads with a pinch of salt. For some reason they interpret my admin complaint as a ban request, which is massively insane as I have no interest in seeing other people get banned and was only wanted to know if headmins viewed the admin's actions in the same fashion. The poster also interprets losing nearly all of my antagonist gear, and all weapons, as a 'minor inconvenience', which is quite the stretch, but perhaps they simply misread the fact the security officer stripped mostly everything I had. I myself requested that note appeal to be closed after I learned who the AI (not the borg who was the actual cause of the issue) was, as I knew them, and play with them regularly with no issues. I chalked it off as an honest mistake and didn't see much reason to continue the appeal at that point.

An awful lot of your time on the forums there seems to be admin complaints because the admins refused to intervene on your behalf to tell other players how you think they should be playing the game.


As I have explained above, I needed to know that the players knew what they were getting into when they for example pushed that button, or if I had a hunch they simply didn't know from the start, let them know in the future so that (if they want to) they can possibly make better decisions. This was simply some assurance that I needed for my soul to be able to see some sort of sense in the way and the reasons for that others interact on the server.

See, the thing is, the peanut thread suggests it is a regular thing.

That is one thread, and it's a peanut gallery thread where people who 1) for whatever reason don't like me and decide that every word I write is intended only in the most negative fashion at all times, and 2) bother to spend time on the forum rambling on ingame happenings or comment on appeals. 1) could be for a number of things, and it could just as well be them not liking that I told them ingame their Engineering idea was completely insane and doesn't work for particular reasons that again are hard to discern unless you've read the code or through trial and error figured out what's what. There are no resources to learn a scarily huge part of the game available, and this problem is exacerbated if you play a role like engineer or atmos tech that requires precise knowledge to operate.

And that's before we start on how accurate the retellings of the people who were in that round were, who didn't have 100% of the information, like admins or myself. Looking at peanut gallery threads is the same thing as reading Youtube/Reddit comment sections. It's not a good idea.

An awful lot of your time on the forums there seems to be admin complaints


There is no other channel for admin complaints, and admin complaints are explicitly encouraged if you disagree with an admin decision for these or those reasons. This is a normal thing on TG.

I have already told you that TG is a completely different environment where standards are completely different, and you should really not attempt to make it an analogue to how my actions on Vorestation would be, and I sincerely doubt you've spent as much/any time there slaving over policy, ingame mechanics, the codebase and their github, as I have.

Heck, biggs is looking at the _amount_ of the notes with absolutely no context or knowledge of what those notes are, and because it's long, assumes it must be bad. Talking to a player, making a note if they did something that was not quite in the rules and should avoid in the future is something that is par for the course on TG. What is an issue is having a note about being told something and then committing the same offense again. Not part of my notes, so they're essentially empty in that regard in terms of misconduct. You are free to browse some of the terrible ban appeals on TG where players were told multiple times in notes to not do thing X.

I really don't understand why you hyper-focus on things you have hardly any knowledge of and I assume you know would need to have in order to make a proper decision over.


Heck, it's been two years. I implore you to let bygones be bygones and let me have another shot at it under greater scrutiny and no tolerance for those same mistakes.
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Re: [Dragor] Muffindrake - Server and Discord ban

Postby Muffindrake » Mon Dec 19, 2022 11:22 pm

Since for some reason the appeals on their forum look frequent to you, here's at least one admin that shares my view with how appeals are used, and there is further people that aren't hell-bent on interpreting the content of the ahelp in the most ludicriously negative way possible.

https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/posting.p ... 3&p=659278
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Re: [Dragor] Muffindrake - Server and Discord ban

Postby Muffindrake » Mon Dec 19, 2022 11:23 pm

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Re: [Dragor] Muffindrake - Server and Discord ban

Postby biggs » Tue Dec 20, 2022 8:00 am

You've basically proven everything I was led to believe about you from your notes and what I've gleaned with this abysmal response.

"Source: Dude trust me" is an absolute joke, and the tangentially related admin post is not the silver bullet you think it is.

I doubt TG Staff need me to white knight for them, but if you think this is how you engage is a basic level of respect, you're comically delusional, at best. Because you would not need to be asked to calm down multiple times. And your seemingly obsessive need to inform other players the "correct" way to play is one hundred percent in line with what I see for why you got banned to begin with. If you expect me to believe that everyone acts the way you did there with as much seeming frequency you do as the norm, TG must have a truly Byzantine level of organization.

You aren't a good source, and your word means nothing. That's what a vouch exists for. For the third time, I mention it. Because your credibility is lost the second a nearly unanimous QC vote is needed to spare the community from you. No, shockingly two pleasant years of you not being here, doesn't lend any credence to the idea it would be better with you back. And that's what you need to reasonably prove for it to have any actual purpose. For you to be someone who's return would not be a detriment to the community.

You can throw me under the bus for not personally knowing TG in depth all you want, but I can read notes and gain important information from them all the same. I lack context? Wow, you know who else lacks context? The future staff member who scans your notes who didn't directly handle it. That's why they provide important information in them. If you wish to cast doubt on the person who drew attention to it for not knowing TG. Well good luck I guess, you must not know anything about Kenzie. I trust Kenzie's knowledge a lot more than I have any reason to trust you.

Maybe you ought to stop hyper focusing on trying and failing to prove that the available behavioral trends for us to look at, that line up perfectly with what we have to look back at are wrong. And instead focus on anything of substance to instill confidence you aren't the type of player to engage in "continued toxic and elitist behaviour to other people in the community"

And
"there does not exist a direct channel to talk to a person on TG, and if you can't figure out who they are on discord, even if their DMs aren't by default restricted to friends, there is no other way to get a hold of them aside from an admin literally direct messaging them ingame."

Sure sounds like a fancy way of saying "I couldn't tell them how to play the game so I got the admins involved"

That sure sounds like an elitist mindset. And pretty toxic to me.
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Re: [Dragor] Muffindrake - Server and Discord ban

Postby PontifexMinimus » Wed Dec 21, 2022 1:37 pm

alright, taking everything into account and my own thoughts on the matter, I am going to deny this appeal.

Thank you for your time.
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